A310-300F problems..

[EHM-1953 Daniel]

i've found a new favorite in our fleet i think that it might not be the most humble and neat aircraft in the world, but i like the panel
but to the point, the autopilot won't fly ILS approaches..
as i'm turning to intercept the localizer i flick on the 'land' button as usual.. but when it should take over from the hdg function, the light under the land button just turns off.. and if i try to click it again it just goes out again.

what am i doing wrong here, or is it the panel...?
'cause the other functions on the autopilot is working well

cheers

[EHM-1001 Robert]

Hi Daniel,

the A300 have another button for ILS approaches, according to the manual. There should be a VOR/NAV/ILs knob which you should rotate into ILS state before approach. Maybe that is the trick...

Good luck ! That is really a nice bird to fly.

[EHM-1953 Daniel]

yeah it is... yes there's a knob wich turns the nav display to the ILS mode.. but the ILS mode on the autopilot still turns off it self... will take a good look at the manual thanx anyway Robert!

[EHM-1953 Daniel]

must admit that after i've read the manual, there're still alot of things that aren't explained...:s i'll just have to try some more ILSs and see if i can figure out what i am doing wrong.. trial and error seemes to be the best option

[EHM-2097 Andrei]

Hi Daniel,

I must admit the A310 panel is one of my favorites too... but not the most intuitive to fly, that's for sure. and the instructions are... instructive, but they mostly say WHAT commands you got not HOW to use them.

Besides the Nav/Vor/Ils knob (which tricked me too), there are a few other particular features you should be aware of:

- There are some functions on the AP (and it may be exactly the HDG & LAND) that are incompatible, but switching one ON does NOT automatically switch the other one OFF. So check which other AP functions are ON while you attempt the ILS approach.

- Most important, NEVER have both ALT and LAND disabled at the same time with the autothrottle engaged, or you are guaranteed to be unpleasantly surprised with the results

Also, though this is not a panel issue, it was most fatal for me with this plane, the AP won't be able to hold the glideslope if you are too heavy. Which is bad, unless you want to know what lies under the runway asphalt .

Trial and error worked for me. However, the "ILS mode on the autopilot shutting off" does not sound familiar to me. What exactly do you mean by "when it should take over from the hdg function"?

Hope this helps

Andrei

[EHM-1821 Javier]

I've had this problem too

by "when it should take over from the hdg function"?, he means that when you set a hdg to intercept the localizer, once the localizer is established, the hdg control should be automatically turned off due to the fact that the APP (LAND in this case) has the localizer and should guide the plane to the runway.

I'm going to 'trial and error' and hope it works

[EHM-1980 Brian]

hi guys - completely off the point here but could someone point me in the direction of a good point by point instruction for using autopilot with ILS approaches? i normally land manually which can prove difficult sometimes :[  any help would be much appreciated!

[EHM-1821 Javier]

1) check and set the ils frequency for the runway you are going to land at on Nav radios and activate them ( 1 or 2 or both)
2) [if no atc] altitude about 3000ft AGL (at least for me), head towards the ils localizer at about 20-30 degrees, and click the APP button of the autopilot. if theres ATC (APP or above), just let the ATC vector you in
3) wait till the APP takes over the HDG hold switch and let the AP do the rest
4) at about 500ft or smth, turn off AP and land manually or otherwise

i hope this covers most of the stuff :]

[EHM-1980 Brian]

cheers Javier thanks mate - will try it out later tonight!

[EHM-1821 Javier]

ok, just 'trial and error'ed once and i got it to work

Problem:


Solution:

;D;D

When intercepting the localizer, after setting the HDG indicator at the intercept heading and altitude, click the LAND button. when this button deactivates itself, its time to deactivate the HDG hold switch and reactivate the LAND button. The ALT hold switch should hold till the LAND takes over it, then ALT hold switch will be deactivated by itself. However, if you find that the aircraft does not get onto the glideslope even if it says so on the PFD or ALT does not turn off on its own after going over the glideslope, turn off ALT hold, descend manually till you are on or slightly below the glideslope (LAND will still control the hdg for you if you have intercepted the localizer) and after doing so for a short moment, LAND will take over the control of the aircraft's descent from there and therefore ALT gets deactivated. If it still does not get on the glideslope, i suggest a go-around or landing yourself with the LAND helping you control your heading

[EHM-1953 Daniel]

OK Javier, sounds good will check it out right away

[EHM-1980 Brian]

hey guys - i found a useful link to a good detailed tutorial about an ILS approach just for those, who like me, aren't too sure how to do one!

http://www.toomuchfs.com/tutorials/ILS/tutorial_ils.htm

Hope it helps

[EHM-2097 Andrei]

Aha!

Thanks for the explanations Javier, I understand now why I did not notice the "ILS mode on the autopilot shutting off" thing: I never tried to engage "LAND" function that early. I usually engage it when I am really close to the localizer (radial) and the glideslope indicator is "awaken".

Is this habit good or bad?  Time to check the Brian's tutorial to find out !

So about the A310, looks like after all it's a (neat) feature of the panel, to notify when you should engage the "LAND" function. Still among my favorites...

Cheers
Andrei

[EHM-1001 Robert]

Well, basically you can activate autoland function further too. When you fly leveled at around 10 nm from the airport, just activate autoland (panel dependant how) and wait until the altitude bug starts coming down, and the autopilot starts acting. If you activate the autoland function when you are already on the glideslope, it can mix the systems for some seconds, surely.

for example on the MD-11 panel there is a "warming" time for the autoland system which is very healthy if you are still leveled during this phase, and not descending already.

[EHM-2097 Andrei]

Hi Robert,

I didn't mean to activate autoland after the glideslope bug begins to move down (I even think that would be a little kamikaze-stylish :s ).

What I meant was that when you are really far of the field (~25nm?), the localizer shows the runway direction but the glideslope bug does not even show or is shown in an idle position. Activating the autoland at this time generally leads to an undesired (and, depending on the panel, sometimes brutal) descent.

Thus I always ensure that the glideslope bug is alive - and up - before activating autoland. And I also prefer to do it when I am close to crossing the runway centerline, turning into the localizer by hand to avoid a high angle offset to be handled by the AP (this last precaution could be redundant)

Cheers
Andrei

[EHM-1001 Robert]

That is correct Although I never had that effect before. Probably autoland needs the ILS to be alive (bugs appear on the PFD), and I never tried it from that distance.

[EHM-1500 Jim]

Where can i find the manual??
Have just tried to fly this plane - cant get autopilot to work, transponder doesnt work etc etc
Please help as it looks like a nice plane.
For example, if i press autothrotle, it just kills the throttles till i stall, pressing alt hold makes me dive down even though i am lower than the altitude....

Cheers, Jim

[EHM-1821 Javier]

the manual is in the aircraft's folder

In the case of the AP, you have to open up your overhead panel and turn on the "pitch trim" button (2 of it but turning on just 1 will do) beside the yaw damper switch (also 2 of it) after this the AP should work

in the case of the transponder, open up the Throttle panel, at where you input the squawk code number, there is a button at the bottom right which you have to click first before clicking the number of your squawk code

[EHM-1821 Javier]

I just remembered another problem with the aircraft, it seems that it takes out fuel in the following order:

CTR tank, outer right tank, inner right tank, outer left tank, inner left tank

i can never get it to get fuel from left and right tanks simoutaneously :[

[EHM-1500 Jim]

Cheers guys, found the manual and have ironed out most problems now. Ta as ever. jim

[EHM-2097 Andrei]

CTR tank, outer right tank, inner right tank, outer left tank, inner left tank

That's very interesting Javier, I hadn't noticed that. But I noticed that on landing the A310 has a *strong* tendency to steer left (while drifting like a car desperately needing an ABS ), which I could not explain - until now!

Could it be because it's braking stronger on the left side, which is heavier because of the asymetrical fuel distribution? Maybe...

BTW, this means that anyone that could solve the fuel problem would solve the left steering problem too!

Cheers
Andrei

[EHM-1821 Javier]

i did a flight with a friend once flying the beluga with the A310's panel, i noticed on the memo display(see above pic for reference to display), it had something like "Fuel Control manual" or somthing, i could not find any switch to turn it to auto though :s

[EHM-1671 Ben]

Hi there everyone, just have a problem here in that the gauges on the A310 panel aren't there! The picture above which Javier took is the first time I've seen any gauges, instruments or numbers anywhere on the panel. This may have been mentioned above but I'm in a rush at the moment so I've only skim-read. Thanks!

[EHM-1465 Dominic]

Ben,

When you first load the panel you need to open the Overhead and supply electrical power to the displays - you can click on the 'Ext Pwr' button if you're at the gate or start up the APU and ensure the 'APU Gen' switch is on... This will then make all the displays appear!

Have fun !!

[EHM-1671 Ben]

Originally posted by EHM-1465 Dominic
Ben,

When you first load the panel you need to open the Overhead and supply electrical power to the displays - you can click on the 'Ext Pwr' button if you're at the gate or start up the APU and ensure the 'APU Gen' switch is on... This will then make all the displays appear!

Have fun !!

Something as simple as turning on the power ALWAYS GETS ME!

Thanks very much Dom - that's why you get the big money.