EuroHarmony Community Forums
Archive => Online Flying => Old Forum => Monthly Fly-in Announcements and Discussions => Topic started by: EHM-1798 Conrad on October 08, 2006, 05:16:14 pm
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Dear Pilots,
The Online Department are proud to release our next event for this Month.
On the Friday 27th & 18:00 we will be Flying from VTBS (Bangkok's new airport) to WSSS in Singapore.
We hope to see you all there! This is a Friday night, so for Javier and Ben, you may be able to attend this time ;)
It will take place on IVAO!
You can find more information on the event pages and scenery links will be added shortly!
Regards,
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Yupeee, I'll be there.
Peter
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Me too :)
I hope a terrible weather there to test our skills ;)
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I can be there, but I don't know about Javier... for me that's Saturday morning, and since Javier is four hours behind me it will be sometime in the middle of the night! I will try my best to be there, though! Thanks Conrad ;)
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aww, can we do it on vatsim? i can provide ATC at WSSS along with others at Singapore vACC :] there dosent seem to be a fly-in on vatsim for a while now(and if we depart from WSSS, i'll have planes to clear lol, just a suggestion ;))
Friday night is good;D
btw, for the weather, expect occasional bad visibility as the burning down of trees in Indonesia, the wind is blowing towards Singapore and its been hazy these few days :s
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Well, i'm not sure how many people at EHM have the vatsim software installed and in a usable condition, i certainly don't. I don't know if i even have a Vatsim account any more. If the Vast majority have Vatsim software installed and have Vatsim accounts, then maybe we will think of changing it. So far it is on IVAO.
Opinions people?
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Hello All,
Seems very promising and interesting to flight in other areas we don't use to practice. Any ideas / freeware sceneries links you can advice for this event ? Or any payware that you like very much for those airports / areas ?
Cheers
Kristoff (EHM-1945)
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Yes there is some amazing Freeware scenery for VTBS (I will post a link in a couple of hours) - for WSSS - Javier ....know the best?
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Quick route from RouteFinder (sorry if this is already on the event page, haven't had a chance to check yet...)
VTBS (Suvarnabhumi Intl) to WSSS (Singapore Changi Intl) 13 fixes, 775.5 nm:
POLAK A464 REGOS M751 PK DCT BIKTA
And there's no RAD/CDR in effect at this time.
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Yes, its all on the event page -
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Conrad. Just a question: if anybody has checked so far if we'll have any ATC ( IVAO or VATSIM ) during this event? I think, your decission concerning the choice of ATC support should be based on some real chances.
Peter
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Well I'll stay away from Razza and Tim if theres no ATC, I don't wanna end up in their formation flying:%
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Well perhaps i could put a message into the Singapore division (if there is one on ivao) - but realistically - how many people have vatsim software and vatsim accounts?
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I have both IVAO and VATSIM...
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IVAO only for me ;)
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Originally posted by Conrad
Yes there is some amazing Freeware scenery for VTBS (I will post a link in a couple of hours) - for WSSS - Javier ....know the best?
I have:
1. Jetways and Terminals for ACOF 9, 10, 11 and 12
2. Singapore Landclass and Objects(includes inaccurate AFCAD of the military Airbase 2nm east of WSSS (Changi) ask me if you want an accurate AFCAD for that via msn)
3. Singapore Central Business District Scenery
4. RWY12 Objects for Singapore Changi WSSS - SIN
Warning: Jetways and terminals for ACOF has some bugs, you may crash before even stopping at the gate or crash a few seconds after stopping at a gate. (Parking is advised instead of Gates;))
Besides this, there is only payware :[
All these can be found on Avsim, just search "Singapore" under FS2004 Scenery
In the search, there is "Singapore Changi Airport Control Tower ". If you are going to download Jetways and Terminals for ACOF, do not download this. If you are staying with default Scenery, it is ok to download this.
btw Conrad, 1800z is a bit late for me and my vatsim singapore vACC collegues as thats 2am, any chance of it being earlier if its on vatsim?
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I vote for...Vatsim! Sorry guys, but I've started flying alot more with Vatsim, and sure, IVAP is better and easier to use, but I don't think that gives us a reason to block all our events from it. WSSS is very very busy on Vatsim, compared to IVAO. On one day, 2 planes were inbound on IVAO, 20 on vatsim, so if you guys want a harder time when it comes to traffic, I'd put vatsim over IVAO any day. Also, the guys at Singapore VACC are always helping. I've flown to Changi about 5 times, and they're very very good. They're always very helping, and will probably love to come along for our event.
Finally, IVAO would probably have no controllers at WSSS, or VTBS. We could use our own guys, but I'm going to assume that it will be risky, as not many are probably familiar with the procedures, except Javier, and he doesn't controll on IVAO, so I'm all for Vatsim!
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However, im not sure if there is going to be much ATC for thailand on Vatsim, ive seen ATC online sometimes on Ivao though. and WSSS still does not have an approach controller unfortunately
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As Javier said it will be to late anyway for them as it's 2am in the morning at the time of the fly-in.
I think we should stick to one network as an VA because there is a greater chance of meeting fellow pilots and also to give training for the OFD if it's needed
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Gentlemen,
Sorry for intruding. We have a very active Southeast Asia division on VATSIM, with many of the controllers being trained in Hong Kong, some of VATSIM Asia's busiest skies. If you are interested we can certainly make arrangements to have coverage. We would obviously need a rough estimate of how many pilots to staff accordingly.
For those of you that may not have VATSIM accounts, we can certainly help with that. We also can make available "loaner" accounts for temporary use. If I can be of any assistance, please do not hesitate to contact me at richard (a) vatsim.net
Thank you for your time.
Richard Jenkins
VATSIM President (VATGOV1)
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Dear Richard,
It's a pleasure to have the VATSIM president writing on our forum!
On our VA, this kind of decisions are taken by the Online Flying Department. I am sure they will analyse your request and answer you as soon as they can!
Meanwhile, thank you for your proposal! I am sure it will be deeply analysed.
Kindly Regards,
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I have Vatsim and thanks to Conrad and Phil - now have a workable IVAO account too.
Either system would be fine and happy to go with the online flying departments decision on this.
Doug Ross,
EHM 1652
EGLL.
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Think my VATSIM setup is still working, although t is probably covered in very thick dust...
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If you guys are flying it on Vatsim, depending on if or when my GND training starts, I will rush from VTBS to WSSS(please let me to be the first to depart;):]) and i'll go on Ground as quick as i can for you guys;D and i'll definitely try to stay awake till 4-5am in the morning;D
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I have both VATSIM and IVAO active accounts so there is no problem. Whatever is the final decision.
Now, please confirm if 18:00 is Zulu time since presently I am temporarily in Mendoza, Argentina which is -3:00 Zulu.
At that time I am at work so I would join probably around 21:00z if this is okay. This would my first for Far East.
Hector Partidas
EHM1749
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Yes it will be 18:00z - Descision will follow later.
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OK, quick reminder... This fly-in is this coming Friday at 1800Z and (going by the generalness of discussion to this point) is going to be on IVAO.
Regarding a fly-in on VATSIM, can I ask everyone to move this discussion to another thread for now (that I'll start in the Online Main Forum in a minute...)
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Anyone understand Thai? http://www.siamavsim.com has a VTBS scenery package, with everything you need to add VTBS in a simple way, but the website is mixed Thai/English and it's beyond me...
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Yes that is a very good scenery package ;) - highly reccomended.
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d**n, cant come, i have something on really early the next day so i cant stay up late:[
btw, my boss at Singapore vACC may be online on WSJC_CTR for the fly-in and because of an agreement between singapore and malaysia vACCs, he will control malaysian airspace too if malaysia is not online so expect ATC ;D
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I think Maabaa may understand that ;) As far as I know he learns some Asian languages.
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Just from reading about this scenery package in other forums, I know that you have to be a member of a particular VA to download it. It's getting into the other VA that is the problem for me, as most all their site is in Thai.
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Just while we're on the subject, I really appreaciate EuroHarmony's decision to put the website in English, despite the fact that for many of the pilots it's not their first language, I have a lot of respect for those who learned it ;)
I will try and be at the event, right now exams are getting close (just a couple of weeks away). However, all work and no play makes me a very upset person! We shall see...
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Hello everyone, I was directed to this website by Javier.
As for as the scenery for VTBS, I highly recommend the scenery on SiamAvsim. You need to register in order to download it, I don't speak Thai, however if you hover over the links you will see the html, this will make understanding it a little easier.
If you go to the left hand side, where you would sign in (if registered), you will see 2 links. Click on the bottom one: http://www.siamavsim.com/main/index2.php?option=com_forum&page=profile&mode=register
You will be able to register here. Once registered you are able to select the scenery on the right hand side. You will need to accept the terms and conditions.
I hope that helps you all out.
Its some great scenery which uses acti gate. (moving jetways when you activate parking brake)
Goodluck, and I hope the fly event goes well.
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Well, thanks to that "walkthrough" from Paul (a big thanks to you for that) I've got the SiamAvSim VTBS2006 package on it's way down.
I *will* be putting it on the event page when it's down, but I must insist that it doesn't get spread around outside the VA (otherwise, it'd be a darn sight easier to get in the first place...)
I can only speak for myself, but I think SinVacc can expect a visit from EHM-0654 in January (regardless of where we decide to hold the Online Event) ;)
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Originally posted by EHM-0654 Murray
I can only speak for myself, but I think SinVacc can expect a visit from EHM-0654 in January (regardless of where we decide to hold the Online Event) ;)
YAY!!! Thanks Murray! Traffic!;D:];D:];D
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I will try to come along. I've already got *contacts* inside SinVACC, so I know some of them, and they're very nice people willing to help. They know WSSS back to front, so I think EHM-1883 will be coming along too!
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Great guys.. good to know there will be some presence of EHM within Singapore airspace. We look forward to providing you all with ATC.
No problem for the brief 'walkthrough'. Happy to assist, I had a little trouble downloading it also so I know the feeling of knowing there is a good freeware scenery and not being able to download.
Javier is quite good at keeping us at Sinvacc, up to date with the happenings of events at EuroHarmony, so if anyone wants some ATC at WSSS, just let Javier know and I'm sure he will pass on the message.
I hope you all enjoy flying on VATSIM tomorrow and enjoy your flight from VTBS-WSSS.
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Well, I am in siamese language license.
I think the most important can be translated by copying and pasting the thai text in http://www.thai2english.com that should be enough for most of it ^^
(Or there is a full web page translation but I don't know what it's worth).
At worst, mail me.
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@P-F: Cheers for that. As mentioned earlier, thanks to Paul from sinvacc I've "sidestepped" all the Thai and got the file I was really after, but that website will definitely be helpful in the future.
@Everyone: Well, following a night of fixing problems of my own making on the forum, I've not been able to do any prep work for the fly-in tonight, so I don't think I'll be able to take part myself as a pilot... I will try to get VTBS installed and everything, but it's definitely going to be tight...
SO...
I want lots of pictures from those of you that are flying to go on the forum. Shove comes to heave, I can always fire up IvAc and either watch you fly (assuming local ATC) or provide GND/TWR if no local ATC.
UPDATE: While looking for an IVAC sector file for VTBS, I've found out that the Thai division appears very active and robust (and they have someone that is a sectorfile genius if the CTR sectorfile is anything to go by... it's "stupidly" accurate in terms of geography) Unfortunately, there is no Singapore division (perfect opportunity to get ahead there sinvacc... just replicate your entire structure on IVAO for the (for us) evening.) ;D
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As if to prove I'm doing everything I can to fly this tonight, I've printed up the two chart packs and I now see that the RouteFinder routing is a little askew (hardly surprising given the newness of VTBS). The SID transition we'll likely want/need to use is REGOS isec... depending on the active, the SID will be one of:
FIRNN 1B/1C from 01L/01R respectively
COMET 1B from 19R
SEESA 1C from 19L
Javier, how's the weather at WSSS today (in general)? Anything heavy we'll need to be aware of either just arriving, already there, or just on it's way out?
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Is FIRNN (and other nav points that are related to VTBS) included in the latest AIRAC cycle? It's not in AIRAC0610.
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I do hope so. The 0610 PM airac knew about VTBS but I didn't get any further along than that. If you have the SID pack from the online page, there are LAT/LONG coordinates supplied for all the RNAV IDENTs. For those without, they appear below:
FIRNN 1B:
> RWY01L (DER)
> VARIS (M015;K220-;R) N13 45.62 E100 45.48
FIRNN 1C:
> RWY01R (DER)
> EXSON (M015;K220-;R) N13 44.90 E100 46.55
thence:
> BS621 (A5000-;R) N13 42.68 E100 57.62
> BS622 (A6000-) N13 30.55 E100 54.29
> FIRNN (A8000+;R) N13 16.48 E100 50.45
> BS624 (FL160-) N13 04.99 E100 44.11
COMET 1B:
> RWY19R (DER)
> ROVEN (M195;K220-;R) N13 36.87 E100 43.18
> BS521 (A5000-;L) N13 31.88 E100 35.64
> COMET (A8000-;L) N13 23.24 E100 34.70
> BS526 (FL160-) N13 04.16 E100 34.81
SEESA 1C:
> RWY19L (DER)
> LOUIS (M195; K220-) N13 35.99 E100 44.21
> BS517 (A5000-) N13 28.70 E100 42.29
> SEESA (A8000-;L) N13 15.07 E100 38.72
> BS518 (FL160-) N13 04.13 E100 37.16
thence:
> JASSY (L) N12 48.33 E100 34.90
> REGOS N12 00.10 E100 34.90
And for those not used to seeing these thing, the FIRNN deps consist of TO and a NAV point, then the four NAV points in the immediately following "thence", then the two NAV points in the final "thence"; COMET and SEESA are TO and four NAV points, then the two NAV points in the final "thence".
UPDATE: I've just downloaded all the 0611 updates from Navigraph that I need, and looking in the vasFMC data (which it turns out is just a series of text files) I can confirm that the two ISECs I looked for (EXSON and FIRNN) are in there.
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0611 is out, however i wont be able to attend, im working tonight ;(
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For PMDG Users there is also a SID/STAR VTBS.TXT available in WWW.NAVDATA.AT.
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Originally posted by EHM-0654 Murray
Javier, how's the weather at WSSS today (in general)? Anything heavy we'll need to be aware of either just arriving, already there, or just on it's way out?
Cant really tell since its night lol, but the haze has cleared quite a lot these few days, PSI level 20-70+ so it should be visibility 8nm or more, also, expect rain as the monsoon season is coming.
I sound like a weatherman dont i? lol;D;D:]
and dont expect me to give more reports as im sleeping in an hour lol, have to wake up for CCA tomorrow morning:[:]
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Cheers Javier, plenty enough detail (have a good night and best of luck with your CCA's)
I saw VTBS_TWR/APP on IVAE a wee while ago - 01006KTS, so we can expect RWY01's (neither controller had the active in their ATIS...)
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Can't make it tonight, got life guard training. 6-10pm :[
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Can't make it either got to work until 1830UTC
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ARGH! My computer crashed on the middle. ...
I think I have the CPU overclocking too high :s
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Sorry that I disappeared from WSSS without saying bye and did not wait on Peter - wasn't on purpose - I had a CTD and could not reconnect :%
It was a nice flight - only the voice of the approach controller was very broken - but we "translated" to each other.
But I highly appreciate that there was a helpful guy controlling us in the middle of the neight (at Singapore).
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Yes, nice flight.
It was myt first flyin and I liked it. Appreciated using multiple chat. I didn't know that.
I wonder why we had different winds at VTBS. I departed from rwy 19 since I had wind from 230.
I also wonder why the app sent us to rwy 02 instead of 20 (different winds again?). I didn't dare to ask since the comm was so bad I hardly could understand him. But of course was great of him to be there.
I think I will be with you whenever possible for me in the future.
Have nice flights,
Luciano
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Re: 02s active at WSSS, I suspect they operate a runway preferential system. As our "man on the spot", care to comment Javier? Given that the 02 approaches keep the incoming airplanes over water until reaching the ground, it'd make sense.
I have a feeling that WSSS_APP was Dutch, and as such only a few hundred miles away from most of us in real life. But yes, his mic really did suck, and the way he was using it didn't help either. You'd think four pilots telling you you're difficult to hear would make you slow down a little bit at least.
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On Vatsim, we use either runway depending on thw wind, however, most pictures i've seen on A.net of inbound traffic were mostly rwy 02, so im not too sure
20C/2C for takeoff and 20R/2L for landing (2C and 20C is 20L and 2R in FS but its been changed due to real world stuff)
If you fly on Vatsim, you'll get Singaporeans for ATC;D be warned of a slight "Singlish" accent though, only joking lol :] We'll speak proper English!;D
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Ooh.. Jav... Given the success of the fly-in last night, and the fact that I'll be wanting to do it again on VATSIM in January (either personally or as the official EHM online fly-in), know any good freeware WSSS scenery?
That siamavsim VTBS is excellent, and really framerate friendly too. It was just a shame that I didn't have something equally nice for Changi...
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Originally posted by 1821
Originally posted by Conrad
Yes there is some amazing Freeware scenery for VTBS (I will post a link in a couple of hours) - for WSSS - Javier ....know the best?
I have:
1. Jetways and Terminals for ACOF 9, 10, 11 and 12
2. Singapore Landclass and Objects(includes inaccurate AFCAD of the military Airbase 2nm east of WSSS (Changi) ask me if you want an accurate AFCAD for that via msn)
3. Singapore Central Business District Scenery
4. RWY12 Objects for Singapore Changi WSSS - SIN
Warning: Jetways and terminals for ACOF has some bugs, you may crash before even stopping at the gate or crash a few seconds after stopping at a gate. (Parking is advised instead of Gates;))
Besides this, there is only payware :[
All these can be found on Avsim, just search "Singapore" under FS2004 Scenery
In the search, there is "Singapore Changi Airport Control Tower ". If you are going to download Jetways and Terminals for ACOF, do not download this. If you are staying with default Scenery, it is ok to download this.
;) btw, if using FSPassengers and if you are going to park at a gate, turn crash detection off in both FS and FSP "more_option.cfg";D
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;D Doh!
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Sorry guys, you had to wait for my landing, but as you most likely noticed, I dissapeared from the screen just starting the last part of the approach. My PC kicked me off, and I had ro reload everythink and speeded up ( 16x to catch you from the point I was before crash.
The flight by itself was a tremendous one and I enjoyed it very much, regardless the controller and his sucking mic. But he tried hard and did his job nicely.
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Wow, what a flight :) Every flyin is a new experience, as it gives more and more bugs/problems in front of me :)
This time was the nasty 2/3 runway system. While the ATC was saying 02R, it was assigned as a military runway, and we had 02C only on the right side. But the stupid PMDG database gave ILS freq for 02L and not 02C :s I could not enter the correct freq manually either, as I could not enter a decimal frequency :!
And then came the ATC guy. (I can tell you guys when I landed he was almost perfectly understandable) But I did not used to get a ILS clearance with a 120 degrees last turn. Of course I missed it for the first time ! And of course I missed it for the 2nd time because that d**n Autopilot landed me on the L runway (because of the bad freqency). But finally I put her down. I do not know why but the brakes were quite weak and I left the runway almost at the last exit.
Anyway, this VTBS airport scenery is beautiful ! I hope we will have some routes here.
Thank you for this great event. See ya up there again soon ;)
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Robert, we always come across these problems! Go on Teamspeak so we can talk about it lol!
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Originally posted by EHM-1001 Robert
This time was the nasty 2/3 runway system. While the ATC was saying 02R, it was assigned as a military runway, and we had 02C only on the right side. But the stupid PMDG database gave ILS freq for 02L and not 02C :s I could not enter the correct freq manually either, as I could not enter a decimal frequency :!
Seems like that controller dosent know much about WSSS runway designations:%
Just to clear up the minds of those who may be confused, WSSS has 2 runways, 2L/20R, 2C/20C while the third runway belongs to the military 2nm east of WSSS known as WSAC. This runway, 2R/20L, is strictly only for the use of Military, mostly F-16s :D Although WSAC is not connected to WSSS by any taxiway, its runway is named 2R/20L so as not to confuse pilots in the real world as it was originally named 1/19 before being changed.
The ILS frequencies of WSSS's runways, 2L/20R and 20C/2C, remain unchanged. So, ILS for 2C/20C would be 2R/20L in FS;)
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Ok, here is a picture of what it should look like in real life
(http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/3048/wssswsacmapxf8.jpg)
Just ask if you have any questions or doubts about it;)
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Here are a few additional 3-D-shots using the payware "The very Singapore"
View from South direction 02 L / R . Right hand the military runway
(http://www.ewetel.net/~jortzick/Data/WSSS1.jpg)
(http://www.ewetel.net/~jortzick/Data/WSSS2.jpg)
View from the airport to the city
(http://www.ewetel.net/~jortzick/Data/WSSS3.jpg)
Terminal 2 (correct Javier?) - New Terminal in construction.
(http://www.ewetel.net/~jortzick/Data/WSSS4.jpg)
Downtown Singapore - Javier will recognise his favourite pub ;)
(http://www.ewetel.net/~jortzick/Data/WSSS5.jpg)
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OMG! you got "Very Singapore"!!!!! How much did it cost? where did you buy it?
Dosent seem totally accurate though, no "Double Airbridges" :]
At least i have 2 thing "Very Singapore" dosent have and thats the "Budget Terminal" and a more accurate AFCAD of WSAC, the military runway ;D
yep, thats Terminal 2 ;D
and im too young to go to a pub lol:]
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wow, nice flight...nice pics, how many of you participated?? Very nice scenery, and Javier, I am so sorry for you...LOL :8 In Italy there is no age limit for pub, while here in Australia you must be 18...
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Originally posted by 1821
OMG! you got "Very Singapore"!!!!! How much did it cost? where did you buy it?
Dosent seem totally accurate though, no "Double Airbridges" :]
At least i have 2 thing "Very Singapore" dosent have and thats the "Budget Terminal" and a more accurate AFCAD of WSAC, the military runway ;D
yep, thats Terminal 2 ;D
and im too young to go to a pub lol:]
Hi Javier,
you can buy it on Simmarket.com (http://www.simmarket.com/product_info.php?products_id=1379), it is 23 Euro (about 28 USD ?). Really nice scenery that will make me fly to WSSS frequently in the future.
Sorry, I did not know your age - so let's say McDonalds or sth. else ;-)
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hehe, no problem :)
quite expensive for me, dont think i'll be getting it :]
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Have to add in a note here, Terminal 3 is the new terminal still under construction (due for completion in 2008) while Terminal 2 was officially opened in 1990 ;)