weird problem...

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Hello all.  Lately I have been having a weird problem where when I reach 25000 feet, the aircraft starts to slow down (no winds what-so-ever), and the auto throttle goes to full throttle, yet it continues to slowly lose speed, and with the 767-300ER its a big problem because all the juice I could get out of her at 31000 feet was 430 GS (leveled off at 31000).  This problem has been happening for a while and I don't know why.  Any suggestions on how to fix this?

[EHM-1617 Iain]

It sounds like you have put too much fuel in the plane and it's too heavy.

Let me guess, you have never bothered with the fuel and always put in 100%

Only load enough fuel for the flight + some reserve.

If the flight is long and you have lots of fuel and are heavy, you will need to step-climb. It goes something like this:

Level out at 15000. Burn off some fuel. Wait for 15 minutes or so.
Level out at 28000. Burn off some fuel. Wait for 20 minutes or so.
Climb to cruise altitude.

The numbers are just fillers, up to you.

This is so that the plane is lighter and can manage to climb higher.

Also check:

Landing gear
Flaps
Spoilers
Etc...

Good Luck

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Thanks a lot for the reply.  Yes, I seem to use 100% fuel a lot :].  I'll see what happens when I try your suggestions.  Thanks again!

[EHM-1555 Kendy]

Hi Jon,

yes Ian is right and use this follow helpful link:

http://www.jersey-va.co.uk/Aircraft-specs/boeing_767.htm

take only this amount of fuel which is necessary for your flight, this possitiv effect is aircraft handling (takeoff/cl/landing,..) and especially the cost of the fuel for Euroharmony and our Airline doesn't want to throw out money for useless fuel

here is a example to calculate the fuel, like a real aviation flight plan would look like:


      KG     TIME

TRIP       96140  09.30              

CONT 5%     8096  00.48              

ALTN        3880  00.23  (Alternate)        

FINAL RES   5060  00.30              

PLNTOF    113176  11.11                

DIFF       .....  .....

PLNTOF    113176.....  .....  (CORRECTED)

EXTRA     .16824....  .....  Max. 41800 Kg   .....

TOF       130000......  .....         .....  .....

TAXI        .800...           500/00.25      .....

BLOCK     130800   (287760 lbs.)    REM FUEL ...... AT ....


if you have further question, don't hesitate to write me back !


regards

Kendy !

[EHM-1627 Chris]

i had a prob the other day in the embarder...i was flying along and the throttle just went to full just like yours Jon.

I kept going, and when i started to decend i got down, and at about 15,000 i was suddenly being told i was traveling at 400+kts airspeed....i got really confused.

[EHM-1437 Jon]

thanks for the help guys, it's been working!

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Hey Kendy!  I didn't understand half the stuff stated to caltulate fuel (not sure why, because I know tons about aviation :%), I did know some of it, but could you please explain what you ment?

[EHM-1555 Kendy]

No problem Jon,

1.  calculate your Trip Fuel (Flighttime x consumption kg/h
2. + add MINCONT  (=bad weather , add 5% of your TRIP FUEL
3. + add ALTN  (=Alternate Airport, your  ALTN is 15 min. away= xxkg)
4. + add HOLD  (= traffic pattern at your ALTN!! ALWAYS 30 min.= xx kg)
5.  = PLNTOF  (=PlannedTakeoffFuel; TOTAL of STEP1-4)
6. + add Extra  (=Extra Fuel is up to you how much,  don't exaggerate!)
7. = TOF  (=TakeOffFuel; TOTAL of STEP5-6)
8. add TAXI  (=usually 500 kg for taxiing to the runway)
9. = BLOCK (=BLOCKFUEL; TOTAL of STEP7-8)

The Blockfuel is the amount of fuel for your airplane (NOT MORE AND NOT LESS!!)

Please calculate the windspeed in your Trip calculation, here you find a good site to do that:

http://aviationweather.gov/iffdp/

Hope I could help you with the fuel calc,.actually now you just have to calculate your TOW (Takeoffweight), its easy:

ZFW (Zerofuelweight; SUM of Dry Operating Weight+ Total Traffic Load)
+
TOF (Takeofffuel; not Blockfuel because you burn the Taxifuel!)
=
TOW (Takeoffweight)


So now you know how heavy you airplane is, but keep one eye one your max. ZFW, max TOW, max Landing Weight ! (you will find your Dry OperatingWeight in many charts of the airplane, or ask our friendly Fleet Manager Róbert Szikszó)



regards,

Kendy Mathes

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Thanks Kendy!  I see what you mean now, but how are you supposed to know the hourly fuel consumption rate for each aircraft?

[EHM-1555 Kendy]

you can find it on several websites , I can't tell you everyone because this are too many, just google

[EHM-1437 Jon]

roger that.  Thanks a lot!

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Hey Kendy!  Sorry to bug you again, but I have one last question.  I googled and yahoo'd fuel consumption rates (some of certain aircraft), and tried different searches of the same type of search as stated.  What exactly should I be searching for?  

Thanks!

[EHM-1437 Jon]

oops...when i searched i found nothing about how much fuel was used per hour.  Sorry, forgot to add that! :]

Thanks again!

[EHM-1555 Kendy]

no problem Jon,

just write me a list with the aiplanes you are interested in for fuel consumption and send it to kendy@euroharmony.com

Bye and good night to North Carolina from Virginia :]

Kendy!

[EHM-1437 Jon]

Alright man I will.  Night to Virginia from North Carolina.  Thanks for the help, you'll get the lise soon!  

[EHM-1001 Robert]

Many times it is difficult to calculate out the fuel consumption. In EHM we do not use the maximum range of the aircrafts, except on class 6-7 routes. This means, while the aircrafts reach the economic altitude+speed, they burnt a lot of fuel, and the relatively short route will not be economic.

When I fill my tanks, I used to "listen" to my experience, and used to browse through my PIREPs how much fuel I used on a given distance.

I do not know how real FS is in fuel consumption, but you can get strange results: for example, when I do a 30...60 minutes short hop in the Capitols of Europe Tour on the Boeing 744, I used to burn 1/3...1/4 amount of the total fuel. Climbing needs a lot of fuel, and if you do not climb to the economic level, you burn unnecessarily too much fuel. Fortunately it is not so significant on smaller planes, and on turboprops.